Our guest in this episode is Peter Verrill. Peter is the Vice President of Business Operations at Heartland Veterinary Partners where he primarily focuses on relationship management between practices and vendors.

In this episode, we cover:

• Peter’s journey from consulting to Veterinary Management

• Peter’s style of management

• What makes Heartland different from other partner groups

• And much more

Thank you so much for listening to this episode! We hope you enjoy it! 

Elliott Greenwood:

How's it going everybody! Welcome back to another episode of Vet Clinic Convos. My name is Elliott Greenwood, and today our guest is Peter Verrill. Am I saying that correctly?

Peter Verrill:

That's correct, Verrill.

Elliott:

Great. How are you today?

Peter:

I'm doing well, thank you.

Elliott:

Well, great. I really appreciate you coming here and I'm really sad that we couldn't start this off based on our intro call because I'll be real honest, that was one of the most compelling stories that you shared and I'm hoping I can get the same experience on this recording for everybody listening.

Peter:

Very good.

Elliott:

So I guess before we kind of jump in, I'd love it if you could kind of give people a background about you, your career into veterinary medicine, to where you're at right now. I know obviously you're not in the medical side of things, but just kind of a little bit about you and your journey to where you are now.

Peter:

Sure. So, you know, I spent most of my career really in management consulting. So doing things really not related to the veterinary industry at all. I was in the international arena doing a lot of manufacturing anywhere from oil and gas to the automobile industry. So really all over the place.

Elliott:

If you don't mind, where internationally were you?

Peter:

I was in Mexico. We had clients from all over the world starting and operating plants down in Mexico.

And you know, I spent a lot of my career in consulting, but you know, as most consultants will tell you, they always want to kind of go and get into an actual business.

And you know, my venture into Vet Med was with Consolidator. They had just kind of started the company and we had a big ER facility that we had just bought. And I spent you know, my first eight months with them working out of that ER facility.

And it was a great experience because, you know, while I had a lot of business background, I didn't know a lot about actually what went on in a veterinary clinic.

And, you know, when I did that, I really was able to get that experience of what it's like to, you know, be at the clinic at one o'clock in the morning cleaning cages because you don't have enough text for the doctors.

And you see all the emotions that go on in a veterinary practice. One minute you're watching people delivering puppies and then five minutes later they have to go to euthanasia. So you see just that emotional roller coaster that people are on.

And then you learn what it's like to deal with clients. managed doctors and the front desk staff and everyone really involved in the veterinary industry. It was a great experience for me.

But one thing I really truly learned out of it was just the passion that people have in this industry. It's really amazing. People are truly passionate about animals and about this just helping animals in every capacity. And it's really It's a great industry to be in and I'm incredibly happy that I found my way into it.

So, I worked with a consolidator for a while and then I made the move over to my current company.

Elliott:

And just for the people listening, what company is that?

Peter:

It's Heartland Veterinary Partners. And we're a similar model to the previous company I was at.

We partner with practices all over the US. And I joined really to kind of help focus on a lot of operational side things around inventory, cost of sales, pricing. And I've been able to grow that and now I'm the vice president of business operations for them. And... kind of manage a group of people, really helping our practices with a whole range of topics, but mostly involving around pricing and vendor relations and inventory, cost sales and procurement.

Elliott:

Wow, that's a great story. I know I've heard it before, but I really liked the, you really get people with that line of going from the full life cycle from birth to death. And that's, I'm glad you were able to touch on that again because I think that's something that's really powerful that most people don't think about when they think of the veterinary industry.

Peter:

Yeah, you know, I have such respect for all the people that work in the vet practices. I mean, it really is an emotional roller coaster on so many levels. And, you know, when you look at the vet industry from, you know, a consultant's lens or from someone who's never been in a practice, you know, it's a fairly straightforward business.

You have certain revenue lines, you have certain expenses. But then you go and work in a practice and you realize this is one of those complex businesses there is. It really is. And for all those reasons.

Elliott:

So one thing I wanted to touch on that I thought was very interesting with what you shared in your story when you first got into the first consolidator is where you started getting the hands-on approach or we'll call it hands dirty approach because you don't or at least I'm not familiar with many Management consultants that really get in the weeds at that level and I'm imagining that's what has led to your Success.

Peter:

Very much so. Yeah, you know, I was always been hands-on with everything I did. You know, even in managing consulting, you know, when we would bring in, you know, and have a, you know, you're going to a new industry, you really have to kind of learn it from the ground up.

So I was kind of used to doing that. Now, this was a little different because you actually are running a practice. It's a little bit different than just kind of getting in and observing.

But, you know, I... I'm a true believer in that. You really have to learn by doing and learn by getting in there and seeing what's going on.

And I think that would probably be my biggest word of advice for anyone wanting to get into Vet Med. You really need to be in the practice and be observant and see what's going on in practice. It's one of the most important things you can do. And it's... it's been, you know, when I look back on it, I wouldn't have done it any other way.

I'm so glad I spent all that time in the practice because it really helped me really learn and understand the business, but also learn and understand how you can, what you can really shape, and what you can't.

Elliott:

Yeah, I mean, that's kind of something I have personally used to guide me in both career and life, but it really started to stick a few years ago when I read, I don't know if you've read the book, Selling Ice to Eskimos.

Peter:

No, I have not.

Elliott:

Even though it's pretty outdated, I think the book came out at least, I mean, I'm very young, but the book came out, I think before I was born sometime in the mid-nineties. Um, but it's about the guy who was the president of the New Jersey Nets. And one of the big principles of that book is to get out of your ivory tower.

And I imagine that's where a lot of frustration with a lot of people in the industry that they might have with consolidators is that they. don't get out of that ivory tower. And basically what he did with that is he would go sit in the nosebleeds of a basketball game. He would ride the shuttle from the parking lots.

And he did exactly what you just talked about as part of what led you to your success, is you got your hands dirty and you were on the front lines. And that's what gave you the perspective to go, OK, this is how this thing works. This is how we can improve, etc.

Peter:

Very true, very true. And it really, the most important thing I think in our industry really is it's really relationships, relationships with the doctor, relationships with the clients, relationships with our vendors. And in order to really build those relationships and know how to build them, you've got to spend time on the floor. You really do. You have to see kind of what goes on in order for you to really be able to build those relationships on the back end.

Elliott:

Yeah, I definitely agree.

So switching gears before, just because I wanted to touch on it a little bit earlier since it was top of mind. But do you want to go into just kind of what makes Heartland a little bit different than just, I feel like there's a bunch of other consolidators popping up all the time.

And I'm kind of curious just to hear your perspective on what makes Heartland different, what Heartland does that allows you to be successful and have successful practices just kind of along that topic.

Peter:

You know, it's really, we're very doctor-centric and we don't jeopardize clinical autonomy, you know, and we're very much, you know, we've developed a very unique and great culture and that culture attracts a lot of people to our company.

And, you know, our mission and really everything we do is around making the lives of doctors and the staff better. and that's really what guides all of our actions. So it's, you know, if there's one main differentiator, I'd say it's our culture. And I don't think too many people would disagree with that.

Elliott:

Yeah, I mean, I think that's very important. You need to have a great culture if you're going to attract, or I guess it's kind of the opposite, is you have an awesome culture. So you attract the best people.

So touching on kind of what you do, you mentioned how you started in pricing and kind of vendor relations and things along that line. I don't know if things have changed now that you're in a newer role.

But if you could only spend four hours a week working in your role, what would you spend your time focusing on to achieve, I guess, to do your best to achieve the maximum? results being that you're only working four hours a week.

Peter:

If I only have four hours a week, I would spend it almost entirely on internal networking and connecting with my team, connecting with the other people in our company, and connecting with our doctors, connecting with our practices.

That is the most important thing we do, I think. develop those relationships and build those relationships or what kind of focus everything else. All the other kinds of busy work is done in conjunction with that.

So that's really how I would spend it, to be perfectly honest with you.

Elliott:

No, I mean, that's kind of what I like to do. And just to make sure I'm kind of understanding you correctly, but when you're in a role like you are, making sure your team is as successful as possible is how you're as successful as possible, correct?

Peter:

Very true. I mean, we're very much a servant leadership company and something I truly believe in. And you really have to, you know, really give your team, you know, clear direction, but give them all the support they need to kind of just go out there and do their thing. And, you know, that's really how we build great teams.

And, you know, it's not necessarily about me going in and dictating and micromanaging and, you know. coming in and doing all this stuff, it's really about guiding people and giving them the support they need so that they can go out and do a great job.

Elliott:

Yeah, obviously it's not the case with you, but I think it's funny that I kind of struggled into that by accident of just being around all people that are way smarter than me. I kind of just found that it was easier to make sure that they had everything that they needed and then just get out of the way.

So I'm glad to hear that even at a level where you're at and in a company like Heartland things don't change. It's still the same principle.

Peter:

Very true.

Elliott:

So switching to something that's a little bit more related to kind of, I guess, you personally because it can be a little bit of anything, but in the past five years, what is a new belief, behavior, or habit that you've implemented that has changed your life?

And it doesn't have to be work-related. This is kind of, this could be personal, this could be physical or health-wise, etc.

Peter:

I think it's not necessarily a belief, well, it's not necessarily behavior, it's more of a belief, but I think you really realize when you truly want to gain success, you really, you need to be able to kind of see it from a high level down. You know, one of the things I kind of learned working in management consulting and really throughout my career was that you know, the closer you're your hands are to the actual product, the less you're able to scale it and the less you're able to really grow it.

Because you're so down in the weeds doing every little thing to try and make it a perfect product you're limited to how big it will ever get. And that's kind of true with a company, with your career, with virtually anything. And so you realize when you kind of take a step back and focus more on... relationship building, building great teams, you know, having a longer-term strategic view and getting your hands out of the weeds is really when you can really start to grow and achieve great things.

Elliott:

Yeah, I mean, I agree with that. That sounds like it also touches on what you said earlier with the Just it helps to, I guess, learn by getting your hands and being hands-on, but you're limited in where you can go with that. So while it's important, I guess it's seeing things from both sides.

Peter:

It really is. I've learned, I think, throughout the years that you try and achieve perfection, especially early on, at least in my career. To do that, you think you need to be involved in every aspect of whatever you're doing. You think you have to have your hands on it and you have to shape it in every single way.

As you get more mature in your career, you realize that you're not going to be able to do that. you have to let go and you have to be more focused on the vision and strategy and less on trying to shape every aspect of it.

Elliott:

Yeah, I mean, I think. That's kind of why taking time off, I feel like, even though it isn't talked about, or it's now only recently being talked about as much, is kind of like how you come up with a lot of good ideas and how you're able to really move things forward, is if you are so focused on that one thing, eventually you get diminishing returns. But if you obviously pivot away from that, like you said, kind of focus on the bigger vision, you start to. see things a little bit different than everybody else who's so focused and missing the forest from the trees.

Peter:

Very true.

Elliott:

So switching back to, I guess, what's more broad in the veterinary space, what trends do you kind of see that you think are really about to become a big deal and how are you trying to position yourself to be successful with that change?

Peter:

Obviously, I think there's a significant amount of focus right now on things like AI and really just the digitalization of a lot of different things. Anything from prices to communication to medical records, everything. It's kind of like digitizing it and then we have the data and then we can use the data. really concerned about when, you know, if you want to bring in a new vendor or what not, you know, how are they going to use the data and how are we going to use the data, you know, because so I think there's a huge trend for that.

You know, how to position ourselves is really around making sure you pick technologies to implement that are proven and that, you know, I think there's sometimes an emphasis to always be on the forefront of all technology, but sometimes you forget that. especially in the veterinary world, there's a veterinary practice that needs to be run.

And while that technology might be fantastic, from the outside looking in, it might not be very practical within a practice. So I think there's always challenges to that. But on the flip side, there is a lot of really neat technology out there that I think can really help improve in a lot of different aspects on how to run a veterinary practice. And we see... all sorts of things now with messaging, text messaging and have it automatic and reminders and forward booking and all sorts of different things that can really be really helpful. But I think there's always got to be that human connection with a client at the end of the day and with the animal.

I see that all the time when a client walks into a vet practice and the front desk knows them, they know their name, they know that the... their animal's name and there's that connection. It's way more valuable than a text message. It just is.

So it's kind of this balancing act of all this new technology that's flooding into the market, but how do we make sure we do it appropriately in a way that adds to the running of a vet practice instead of takes away from it.

Elliott:

And is there anything that you have off the top of your head that does exactly that, that adds to it, instead of kind of takes away?

Or is there any just ideas that you might have on how to do that?

Peter:

I definitely think that there's definitely some things around client reminders that can be automated that can help initiate that. As long as it's paired with the actual speaking with client at that point, I think it can be really helpful.

We're seeing a lot of things around... cloud-based PIMS for instance, where you can access medical records, you know, easily without having to be actually in the practice or to be, you know, dealing with a bunch of equipment in the practice that can be, you know, all of a sudden now you have an issue with your server and you can't enter medical records and, you know, delays all sorts of appointments and everything else, whereas you implement a technology like a cloud-based PIMS and then all of a sudden... that kind of goes away.

So there's various things, I think, across the industry. But I think it always has to be really careful on analyzing it before you kind of jump on and just go all in on it.

Elliott:

Yeah, now that makes sense. And I really think that is important because I think that's kind of what has been the biggest, I guess, plus for the veterinary space is I feel like because of that human touch, it's what has made at least, obviously, there are a few outliers.

But. I feel like the experience, at least from the ones I've seen, of people going to vet practices, that's one of the things they do enjoy the most, is that everybody knows the pet's name. Everybody is familiar with the situation, and it's a lot more personable than the average, I guess, customer experience you might have in 2023.

Peter:

That's very true and that's really a key part of the veterinary industry and to really have a healthy and growing practice is to have that good interactions with the clients. I think you always have to be very careful in anything that might jeopardize that.

Elliott:

Yeah. So without jeopardizing that, is there a particular piece of bad advice or bad recommendations that you hear from other people in the space?

Peter:

I would say that one thing I think I hear a lot is one particular technology is going to revolutionize everything and change everything. I would say that that's maybe not the case.

The other kind of thing that I would say is some people think that if something is good for one vet practice, it's good for every vet practice. The reality is it's not. the veterinary industry is very much individualized in that regard.

Practices are all unique and what makes one practice run well might not make another practice run well. So it's really important to kind of make sure that I think people really understand that you really have to know that practice, know what makes it tick and instead of thinking we can just do one thing and push it out to every practice and it's going to work great for every practice. It's really not.

Elliott:

Yeah, no, I mean, that definitely, I understand that that's the case. I guess kind of touching on that. So even though you say something isn't always going to work for every vet practice, is there some standard that you look for to measure success in a veterinary practice, whether that's just kind of a characteristic or even if it's an actual quantifiable metric, is there kind of something you look at? typically at least just from your point of view.

Peter:

Yeah, I mean, I think, well, you know, obviously you have certain KPIs you always look at for any business, you know, when you look at revenue, cost of sales, EBITDA, all of that, but that doesn't really tell the story.

You know, to really understand it, you know, it's really about the doctors you have there, the doctors that are mentoring other doctors that come in and kind of continuing that legacy in the practice. You know, I've seen, I've seen and talk to clients that have driven an hour to go to their veterinarian.

Elliott:

Oh wow.

Peter:

They've done it for 20 years and they'll always do it.

Elliott:

Oh wow.

Peter:

That's an incredibly successful and healthy practice and that's not really measured simply by looking at just the KPI. So there's a lot of things that go into it. I kind of alluded to it earlier when I said from a consultant's eyes, it's a very kind of straightforward business, but it's just so complex in terms of what makes it a really successful practice.

You just have so many different things that go into it and it's really a combination of everything that that makes it a successful practice.

Elliott:

Yeah, wow, I've actually never heard.

And I'm assuming that's not in a rural area for the person to drive an hour away. Because,

Peter:

No, that was here in Houston that I talked about.

Elliott:

Then yeah, wow, no, that really does speak volumes, because I know my grandparents do that, but they live in rural Louisiana.

So they kind of have to do that. But wow, that's kind of crazy. I really only have two final things I'm curious to pick your brain on, but they're more related to you personally. Is there anything before I do so that you want to touch on? whether it's related to kind of the company or to the industry as a whole.

Peter:

I'm probably, you know, one thing I would say about the industry as a whole, it's a great industry. It really is. And I say that truly because of the people that work in it. You know, it really is. And there's a lot of exterior kind of forces that are emerging now that really haven't in the past.

So it'll be interesting to see how it goes. You know, just, you know, the chewies of the world that now. all of a sudden, a huge behemoth of a company that 20 years ago didn't exist.

So there's a lot of different factors that come into it. But at the end of the day, it's just a fantastic industry. It's a growing industry. And really, the fact that there is so much interest in the industry now is really telling of just how strong that industry is. And you really, I think the changes that are have happened in the veterinary industry for the most part have been good and that there is a strong, I think, desire for people to really, not only get involved, but to really keep shaping this industry in a good way. And I'm happy to see that and happy to see it grow.

Elliott:

Well, I love the optimism. It's, that's probably one of the best arguments I've heard for taking in all the change that's happening, but still seeing it in the positive light, because I feel like most people are not thrilled that Chewy is joining the space, and you seem to be saying that it's signs of growth.

Peter:

Well, let me be clear, I'm not happy with that ever, but I do think there are ways around it.

You know, I don't see it as a way of just hurting you.

Elliott:

I mean, I didn't mean to say that you were saying that you absolutely adore it, but you're seeing it as signs of progress in the industry that clearly if some story of going from like you said, I mean, they didn't even exist 20 years ago and now they're the 800-pound gorilla in the industry, but it's still just a good sign of that, hey, this is an industry that's growing and not seeming to slow down anytime soon, if that's the case.

So is there any unusual habit or an absurd thing that you love that I guess maybe most people don't do or wouldn't expect to hear from you?

Peter:

How did it work out? I would say that. Yeah, I would say my... Well, one of the things that I do when I go on a vacation, I don't plan anything at all.

And I'll tell you a little quick story. I actually drove a car from San Diego all the way to Panama. And we didn't have a plan.

Elliott:

like the country?

Peter:

The country Panama.

Elliott:

Wow.

Peter:

So we didn't have a plan.

We just kind of got in and went. And most people that know me in a work-related industry, I plan and I focus.

So that's kind of a unique thing I think that is a little different than I think most people.

Elliott:

How long did that drive take?

Peter:

We took a total of two months to do it.

Elliott:

Wow. Wow, that sounds very, I'm hoping that you didn't run into, I mean, I don't know the full situation, but I can imagine that most people who travel to Central America don't drive.

So was there any interesting encounters that you had on your drive down or?

Peter:

We could do a whole podcast on that.

Elliott:

Oh wow. Okay, well, I might have to book you for a round two just on the Panama drive.

Peter:

It was a lot. But it was great. It was fantastic. Got to really meet a lot of people and explore places that you wouldn't normally explore. This was a lot of fun.

Elliott:

Yeah, I mean, I guess for two months and just driving, that's just, I've done a cross-country road trip. I've not done one that long, that is for sure. That has to be full story. So yeah, no, that sounds awesome.

I guess the final thing and what to close it out with is, what is the best investment that you, or most worthwhile investment you've ever made, whether monetarily, time-wise, energy, done for your, increasing your energy, stuff like that.

Peter:

The best investment I've ever made, I think, hands down, is really just education on really every level. You know, I'm a big believer in investing in yourself with education, whether it's formal or informal, end of the day.

Whether it's just buying a book about learning Spanish and taking every day and taking an hour and learning it on your own.

Or if it's, you know, going into a class and doing not, but I truly believe that. And I think that in my career, all the investment I've done in my education, both money and time has been well worth it.

Elliott:

Yeah, I'm definitely a big believer in continuing education. And it's especially crazy growing up with YouTube, even though I love to read how much good quality content is out on YouTube for free.

Peter:

Yep, very much so.

Elliott:

Well, Peter, I really appreciate you coming on. I don't know if there's anything else you want to say before we close it out.

Peter:

No, I think we've been pretty comprehensive about it. Really enjoyed being on here. Really, really good. Glad I got the invite.

Elliott:

Well, I appreciate you coming. Is there any place that you want people to look for you?

Peter:

You can look for me right on LinkedIn.

Elliott:

All righty. Well, I will go ahead and include that in the link below. And I really appreciate you coming on. All righty. Well, enjoy the rest of your day. Bye.

For more info on the episode, see the sources below.

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/peterverrill/

• https://heartlandvetpartners.com/

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